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R is also an array language, but a non-iversonian one. Another good ressource for array languages is https://aplwiki.com/.

r/apljk on reddit is also active.


That's my understanding too. R never seems to make these lists.


numpy is also an array language, with a userbase that of (R+k)^10

never seems to make these lists :)


Maybe the internal broadcasting mecanism in numpy don't allow this nativelly ?


The post I referenced before shows that broadcast is not a general solution.


the top comment trick [ n, 1, n + 1, 0 ][n % 4] can be implemented in J as following :

   f =: ]`1:`>:`0:@.(4&|)"0
Then:

   (,. ; #: ; [: #: f) i.16

 0    0 0 0 0    0 0 0 0    
 1    0 0 0 1    0 0 0 1    
 2    0 0 1 0    0 0 1 1    
 3    0 0 1 1    0 0 0 0    
 4    0 1 0 0    0 1 0 0    
 5    0 1 0 1    0 0 0 1    
 6    0 1 1 0    0 1 1 1    
 7    0 1 1 1    0 0 0 0    
 8    1 0 0 0    1 0 0 0    
 9    1 0 0 1    0 0 0 1    
....


Hello fellow J programmer. In statistic you can estimate the population size by coloring fishes that you put in a lake and some time later you fish in that lake, the proportion of colored fishes allow you to estimate the size of the population. Four month ago I posted some J identities [1] and you were the only one which commented, that means that in this capture I only got one fish and it was the colored fish. This imply that there must be very few J programmers HN, or more precisely, very few of them that post J related material.

The parent's comment (also mine) has a style that was designed not to scare non J programmers. One should also consider that some people dislike J code so downvotes are the usual result except when the post provides some additional insight.

Finally, thank you for this small J lesson, is a pleasure to find here fellow J programmers.

[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42859077


Array programming requires true array languages like apl and j.


J has revolutionized the way I think. I can confirm it: ever since I learned to program with it, I’ve been able to solve so many problems that previously felt far beyond my (limited) intellectual reach. For me, J (and by extension, the APL family more broadly) has contributed as much to my thinking as the methodologies I learned during my university studies in philosophy. Suffice it to say, it has profoundly and positively shaken me.


The other commenter asked about why J, but I want to more specifically ask, why did you choose J over K? I can't decide which to learn.


Answering for myself, I started looking into APL, but at the time, learning the keymaps for the symbols seemed difficult, so I started learning array lang techniques with J, and ended up liking it.

Some of the knowledge you acquire from one array lang can translate to the others, but the semantics are not 1:1 (ie. J is not just ASCII APL).

As it currently stands, I dabble in almost all the array langs, but of the ones I use, I think best in J. It's got a lot of convenience in it's large set of primitives, and there's no "indirection" between the character you want, and the one you type. Still, it's not without it's shortcomings.

I think I would probably still recommend BQN to most people looking to get into array programming, as it removes some warts in APL/J.

You lose some convenience functions (base conversion, fixed-point, etc) but you get a language which is more uniform and intuitive. And FWIW, I had the keymaps learned within the first day I started to play with it.

It's still a learning curve regardless of which lang you learn, but it will change how you think.


J is free. k is closed Source,and cost a life.


a. How did you get into it?

b. Why J, as opposed to another APL implementation? In particular, the different syntax, I suppose I mean.

Thanks!


It's free and allow use of standard ASCII characters


Maybe not everyone involved is quite the genius you might've been expecting.


I guess I don’t buy that.

Many non technical people use VPNs to access region restricted content. It is trivial to understand and use.

Assuming this all actually happened as described, it sounds like someone wanted it to appear that these attempts were coming from Russia.


And/or they just dgaf because they know they or anyone else involved won't ever be held accountable.


Occam’s razor would also suggest a hoax as one of several very credible possibilities.


Occam's razor would suggest someone from Russia could just use their own IP because people like you would think it's a hoax anyway.


Why does someone from Russia want access to NLRB data, and why would DOGE be immediately leaking just-granted NLRB login credentials to Russian assets when it would be trivially traceable back to them, and if they were in fact granted untraceable/unlogged admin credentials, could legitimately download the data themselves and simply hand it over to said Russian assets if that was their actual intention?

It's not behavior that makes any sense assuming even a semi-rational/intelligent actor.


> Why does someone from Russia want access to NLRB data

It has details of labor disputes. Which if you’re Russia who thrives on fostering conflict in the US would be an ideal data set.

> Why would DOGE be immediately leaking just-granted NLRB login credentials to Russian assets

Because they are young, highly inexperienced engineers who have been tasked with rolling out their LLM system as quickly as possible. Their priority is not security.


Your argument is that they are so inexperienced and insufficiently monitored that they immediately leaked just-granted NLRB login credentials (how?) to Russia, while rolling out an LLM system (what system?), and the Russian assets that acquired those credentials were so inept that they risked their access — and had their logins rejected — by immediately attempting to use them directly from a Russian IP block?

Furthermore, that the NLRB data would somehow be of sufficient value to Russian state actors to justify risking burning their access to DOGE employees/data/credentials through frankly idiotic OPSEC, despite there being much higher value targets than the NLRB?

This even remotely doesn't pass the smell test.


a) No one knows how Russia had the credentials but they did.

b) This system: https://www.wired.com/story/doge-is-just-getting-warmed-up-d...

c) DOGE under its current form will end in the next weeks/months as Musk moves on. So if you’re Russia the best bet is to get as much data now as you can.


> Whoever was attempting to log in was using one of the newly created accounts that were used in the other DOGE related activities and it appeared they had the correct username and password due to the authentication flow only stopping them due to our no-out-of-country logins policy activating.

Explains this:

> why would DOGE be immediately leaking just-granted NLRB login credential

The implication is that the credentials were for more than this specific system. It's entirely feasible that a bad actor would immediately try to vacuum up as much data from as many systems as possible, it's just that this system had a geo block that made it clear this was happening.

I don't think we need to assume that this was a targeted attack on this specific NLRB system, just that this specific NLRB system was the one that caught the attempts.

So, what systems DIDN'T block authentication?


J


By what metric is that a systems language?


Maybe codfns for apl will solve this ? That's what I understood.. but maybe I'm wrong.


I am wondering about this as well. What is the gap between what you're envisioning and codfns?


-: and :- are not the same... Maybe some typos... But your list shows how left and right terms are the same in each identities. Look like some pedagogical stuff.

For instance :

(],[) -: ([,])~

(],[) Appends right and left term while ([,])~ append left and right term after arguments order inversion.


Wow it's very interresting. I published it on reddit.com/r/arraylanguages thanks a lot!


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